[Bug or Design?]

If Flo goes has Ketarin write a new filename anytime the filename does not exist (and delete old versions is not selected), that will take care of getting a new file on disk even though the same file was written already to another name.

 

Then, for those disk files where we simply cannot put up with accidentally overwriting the previous version name with the new program, we can use the special variable (edit the app, it's on the 'advanced' tab, at the bottom).

 

The special variable works very well, I've been using it with a particular program that the author (for reason still unknown to me) keeps updating the file dates on, even though the program itself has not been updated. Without this special variable, Ketarin would see the new dates every few days and redownload the same file.

[Bug or Design?]

I know you asked Flo but that's in essence what the special variable does. That variable guarantees as as long as the contents of it have not changed, Ketarin will not download a new file for any reason.

 

Do you envision your idea working differently from this? If you can elaborate some examples...

[Bug or Design?]

@CybTekSol

 

Not sure how my case differs from you, but my previous disk file of 2.8.3 is really 2.8.4, in this situation I've lost the real version 2.8.3.

 

Not Ketarin's fault of course, Ketarin had no way of knowing that my variable scrape unfortunately was still grabbing 2.8.3 even though it was a new file.

 

Once I changed the variable to 2.8.4, yes I'd like Ketarin to redownload the file to that name, even though I already have the identical file with 2.8.3 for the name. But Ketarin still can't help me that my real 2.8.3 version is gone -- I'm just going to have to get it from the site and/or backups if I need it.

 

Like regex and everything else, we're at the mercy of the website. One thing that WOULD stop Ketarin from overwriting a current version with a new one, when the vers variable scrape did not change, is to put that vers variable into the special parameter that tells Ketarin NOT to consider it updated if this variable has not changed.

 

Then if my webpage guy ever got around to fixing it and making it say version 2.8.4, Ketarin would then download the new file.

 

Another reason independent verification (with page watching service, the Ketarin feature I proposed, whatever) is also very important. Can't know what you can't know, if you know what I mean? Ya know? :)

 

--appyface

[Find command in log?]

@CybTekSol

 

Copy and paste right-click is already available in Log window...? Does that not work for you? You have to select something before copy will work, FYI.

 

Dunno about failed update window, I see that window all the time but haven't tried to copy from it in awhile.

 

But yes I second the idea that in both places, both keyboard (CTRL-A, CTRL-C, CTRL-V) and right-click (Select-all, copy, paste) would be nice to have available...

[Bug or Design?]

Thanks Flo. Maybe someone likes that design, should it be user selectable?

[Bug or Design?]

I hope I can explain clearly...

 

Ketarin is downloading Orbit for me. The URL for download is static one, the download name does not include any version info:

http://dl.orbitdownloader.com/dl/OrbitDownloaderSetup.exe

 

As many of us do, I put the version number I scrape from a page in the site, on the download filename:

d:\stuff\filestore\iutils\{url:basefile}_{vers}.{url:ext}

 

Until today's Ketarin run, the version scraped was 2.8.3 so my download filename was this:

D:\Stuff\filestore\IUtils\OrbitDownloaderSetup_2.8.3.exe

 

Today I run Ketarin and it downloaded a new file, because (from log) the file sizes did not match. My new download is still

D:\Stuff\filestore\IUtils\OrbitDownloaderSetup_2.8.3.exe

 

I check the webpage I'm scraping for {vers} and sure enough the version number is still 2.8.3 there. I check another page in the site and it has been updated, version is 2.8.4.

 

So. I edit the app in Ketarin and change my {vers} variable scrape to use the webpage with 2.8.4 on it.

 

Next I issue CTRL-U on the Orbit app, and I see the {vers} variable contents were changed (vers is displayed in my custom column). But Ketarin did not download and create a new filename of

D:\Stuff\filestore\IUtils\OrbitDownloaderSetup_2.8.4.exe

 

as I had expected? That filename doesn't yet exist... but it appears Ketarin didn't check for existence of downloaded filename? (Note I do not have the option "delete previous downloaded file" selected as I want to keep these versions.)

 

2/4/2009 5:35:38 AM: Update started with 1 application(s)

2/4/2009 5:35:39 AM: Replacing {vers} in 'd:\stuff\filestore\iutils\OrbitDownloaderSetup_{vers}.exe' with '2.8.4'

2/4/2009 5:35:39 AM: Orbit Downloader: Checking if update is required...

2/4/2009 5:35:39 AM: Orbit Downloader: Update not required

2/4/2009 5:35:39 AM: Update finished

 

 

Bug or design? I do recall some posts here asking for Ketarin to not download again after a file has been renamed... Was that implemented? Is it user-switchable per app if so? In my case I would like Ketarin to download it again after I have caused a change to the disk filename...

 

Thoughts?

 

Thanks as always,

--appyface

[Focus (highlight) "glitch"?]

Not really sure this is a bug, per se, but it is just a teeny bit annoying to me :-/

 

Sometimes I have an app line selected (highlighted) in Ketarin main window, but keyboard commands don't work against it (CTRL-U, CTRL-C to copy it, ENTER to bring up edit app dialog, etc.).

 

This seems to occur when Ketarin finishes being busy doing something else. Ketarin lets me highlight the app while it is busy, but then doesn't seem to know about the highlight after the current task finishes?

 

To see example.

 

Highlight a few or more apps that will take at least several seconds for Ketarin to check for updates. While Ketarin is busy checking these apps, click on another app (not in the group being updated).

 

Ketarin will highlight the app you just clicked on. Don't do anything else, just wait... understandably Ketarin is busy and can't do anything with a new request yet anyway. So just wait until Ketarin has finished with the current updates.

 

Now, with the new app line still highlighted, press CTRL-U. Nothing happens.

 

A simple workaround is to click away and click back on that app, Ketarin now 'sees' that app and a CTRL-U etc. will work.

 

Thoughts?

 

Thanks and regards,

--appyface

[Find command in log?]

Another very minor request...

 

A simple "find" command in the log window?

 

Sometimes I see Ketarin did/didn't update an app when I thought it ought to be different, I can hop into the log and see what happened.

 

Current workaround is to right-click, choose select-all, CTRL-C (or right-click, choose copy), launch a text editor, and paste log contents there.

 

Not a big deal. But for a quick checkup on one or two apps in a big log, CTRL-F would be handy.

 

Thanks and regards,

--appyface

 

P.S. Could we have CTRL-A also invoke the 'select-all' function in the log window? I tend to be a keyboard person and not a right-click person. Again no big deal, but if it's easy...?

[Ketarin 1.0RC]

Hi Flo,

 

I have a minor situation with the GUI...

 

I have the 'target' column on display, and I have moved it to the far right of all other columns. I have the Ketarin window as wide as my screen width will allow. But some of my pathnames are long and the display cuts them off.

 

Unlike the other columns, I can't seem to get the vertical split cursor to appear at the far right edge of the 'target' column's header, so I can double-click it to optimize the column width or drag it to the right to enlarge the column. I also don't have a left-right scrollbar at the bottom of the Ketarin window.

 

As you may recall, I didn't have 'target' on display before now because of its fixed position, so this may or may not be new.

 

Is it possible to control the size of this column and scroll to view all of it?

 

Thanks and regards,

--appyface

[Ketarin 1.0RC]

I'm still seeing CTRL-G sometimes put the cursor someplace other than at the start of the highlighted match. Shouldn't CTRL-G take me right to the highlighted string, or am I misunderstanding what CTRL-G is supposed to do?

[saved file location : predefined variable ?]

@Stalker you beat me to it :-)

 

@fat115

 

Ketarin does not have an installer. Create a directory somewhere to your liking and put Ketarin.exe and System.Data.SQLite.DLL in it.

 

The first time you run Ketarin, it will create a file called jobs.db in a predefined location, I forget exactly the path now but it is in Documents and Settings folder. That jobs.db file is the one any instance of Ketarin will use, so you will only have one database.

 

So to work around that. You can put Ketarin.exe and System.Data.SQLite.DLL both into two or more folders, AND copy your jobs.db into all of these folders. Ketarin will use the jobs.db it finds in its own folder, and will ignore any located in Documents and Settings. (You can delete the stuff in Documents and Settings if all your Ketarin instances have their own jobs.db files with them.)

 

A trick you can use to get a good jobs.db file with each Ketarin instance: Before you run Ketarin for the first time in a directory, create an empty (0-length) jobs.db file in that directory. Then launch that directory's Ketarin.exe, it will find and format the empty jobs.db file that it finds in there, rather than trying to look in Documents and Settings for one. Ketarin will come up with an empty database ready for you to start defining your applications.

 

You can then of course create shortcuts to each of your Ketarin.exe's if you wish, and put them into your Start or Programs menu or on your desktop, so you can easily access the separate databases for each purpose you require.

 

Hope that helps,

--appyface

[Automatic updating]

LOL as I said I didn't try it. Just reading the info, it says there will be NO GUI. Nothing else is mentioned in the doc that I could see... what else does it do?

 

So. You're saying when the SILENT switch is added, Ketarin will also exit when done? How about if Ketarin launches another process after it finishes updating? Will Ketarin still exit?

 

Questions... Questions...

[Automatic updating]

OK so you WERE able to help yourself figure out how to use the command line options? That is good Now we are back to Ketarin questions

 

I have not tried either of those options, but I agree they do not look like they would close Ketarin after updating.

 

???? I have same question as emil.

[Automatic updating]

What do you see when you put

 

how do I run a program from the command line

 

into Google?

 

emil, please I don't mean this in an angry way, please do try to help yourself first before posting?

 

We will be happy to try and help you with problems related to Ketarin but many of your questions here are centered around basic and general windows skills. There is a LOT of good information on the internet to help you learn these skills... just start googling your questions and see what you get.

 

Again PLEASE don't take this the wrong way? I'd just like to see you try to first hunt up the answers for yourself. The more you try to do that the better you will get at helping yourself. OK?

 

Best,

--appyface

[Automatic updating]

Look at the top of your page, see where it says "Documentation"?

[Sorry -- WAY OT to Ketarin... but I just had to share!]

We don't have a forum here to discuss things having nothing to do with Ketarin, so PLEASE forgive my outrageously off topic post...

 

A friend sent me these video links, they are Kate and her dog Gin in competition on "Britain's Got Talent" last year. I didn't even know about the show. What a darling pair these two are, even if you are not an animal lover you must be able to see the special friendship these two have:

 

competition

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NAGWvR9pAPI semi-finals

 

finals

 

 

Sorry again for OT post but I was just so happy watching these two together, that I wanted to spread a little sunshine around

 

--appyface

[Automatic updating]

I don't understand your question? Nothing can happen on a computer if it is not turned on?

[Automatic updating]

Look at the options that are available to you in Task Scheduler. If you haven't yet, do read the help file for Task Scheduler.

 

Do not create overlapping tasks or more than one Ketarin will be running! Depending on how you set the regular options plus the advanced options, you can cause that so be careful.

 

Try this. Set the job to run once daily at xx:xx time (example: 10:30am) on the regular options. Then go inside advanced options, repeat every 60 minutes for 24 hours.

 

The job will start at 10:30am, then will repeat every hour for 24 times. Then the job is done. But because you said run it DAILY at xx:xx time, the job will start up again the next day at the same time and repeat itself every hour for 24 hours.

 

That is "forever" as far as I can tell... your machine is likely to quit long before "forever" though :-)

 

This conversation is more appropriate to a windows forum than Ketarin forum though, if you have more questions about the Task Scheduler the folk on one of those forums would be better equipped to help you figure it out.

 

Good luck!

--appyface

[Automatic updating]

@Flo - I haven't looked at what Ketarin's command line interface looks like (even though I am one who asked for command line long ago ) I assume Ketarin will quit when it is done, or there is a switch to tell it it to quit and not leave the GUI up?

 

@emil

If Ketarin will quit when it is done checking for updates, then maybe you can approach your problem this way.

 

Instead of Ketarin running "all the time", have Ketarin run, check for updates, then it quits. Then 15 minutes later run Ketarin again, check for updates, and it quits. Then 15 minutes later.... all around the clock, 24 hours a day... example:

 

1. 10:30am - job starts Ketarin to check for updates

(a few minutes later, Ketarin finishes checking and quits running)

 

2. 10:45am - job starts Ketarin to check for updates

(a few minutes later, Ketarin finishes checking and quits running)

 

3. 11:00am - job starts Ketarin to check for updates

(a few minutes later, Ketarin finishes checking and quits running)

 

This way there is only ONE Ketarin running at a time in the system, and it quits when it is done checking and getting your updates.

 

If you ever have so many updates that Ketarin does not quit before 15 minutes, you will have two of them trying to run, which will not work, so you must increase the interval to 20 minutes, or 30 minutes... or whatever time Ketarin needs to finish before the next runtime.

 

Do you have updates that are so important as to require checking every 15 minutes? Maybe one run per hour would be often enough? It looks like you started out by wanting to run it hourly, that could be easier to get working properly.

 

--appyface

[Automatic updating]

Thanks FranciscoR, what you have posted makes sense to me. Let's see what emil comes back with :-)

[Automatic updating]

When I closed Ketarin it started automatically but when Ketarin is in tray it doesn't work.

I'm sorry emil, I have no idea what you mean when you say this? What is "it started automatically" and what is "Ketarin is in the tray"?

 

Maybe someone else here can help you, I'm quite lost as to what you're trying to do... sorry...

[Ketarin 0.9.9.22 beta]

By order of precedence, what I meant was, Ketarin would have to figure out what variable has to be solved first, so that the next could be solved using the result from the earlier one, and so on.

 

In other words, deeper than top level definition. Totally understand if you don't want to add that complexity. For as little as it will probably be used, the two 'workarounds' I wrote above, are perfectly fine.

 

But 'we' (there I go again) need to get that documented (someday when 'we' all have a little more time on our hands) because I know that I'll forget why it doesn't work (again), and I'll bet sooner or later someone else will ask the question too.

 

Thanks for looking at the window thing, it was so weird that I had just posted an idea to emil when it happened to me!

[Automatic updating]

@emil

 

1. I cannot tell from your information, if your task scheduler entry is a good one (will it run?)

 

2. I cannot tell if starting at 11:08 is in the past (can't start in the past)

 

Just for testing, edit this task scheduler entry and change it to run just once, at some time in the future (make that at least 5 minutes later from your current system time). DO NOT CHANGE ANYTHING ELSE BUT THE SCHEDULING. Does it run? If it does then you know the answer to #1 is that it's OK. (If you already did this before changing it to running every 15 minutes you can skip this step)

 

Now that you are sure it can run, change the schedule back to running every 15 minutes and make sure the first start time is at least five minutes in the future from your current system time.

 

Also visit the 'settings' tab and make sure you don't have anything marked that would stop the task from running.

 

Also make sure the check box for enabled is marked (X), and if you also checked the box "only when logged on" make sure the username you have in the runas box, is logged on.

 

If none of the above solves your problem, I recommend you visit a Windows XP forum for more help, as this is not a Ketarin issue but probably something wrong with your windows installation.

 

Good luck,

--appyface

[Ketarin 0.9.9.22 beta]

No, that won't work. Ketarin only replaces variables once within a string, not twice.

 

Wait a minute... I think this is what I was remembering, because this works:

 

define variable: test1 textual content {f:yyyy}{f:MM}{f:dd}

define variable: vers textual content {test1}

 

1/29/2009 4:23:09 AM: Update started with 1 application(s)

1/29/2009 4:23:10 AM: Replacing {test1} in '{test1}' with '20090127'

1/29/2009 4:23:10 AM: Replacing {vers} in 'D:\Stuff\filestore\Updaters\Ketarin-0.9.9.22_{vers}.zip' with '20090127'

1/29/2009 4:23:10 AM: Ketarin redownload 0.9.9.22 beta: Checking if update is required...

1/29/2009 4:23:10 AM: Ketarin redownload 0.9.9.22 beta: Update not required

1/29/2009 4:23:10 AM: Replacing {test1} in '{test1}' with '20090127'

1/29/2009 4:23:10 AM: Replacing {vers} in '{vers}' with '20090127'

1/29/2009 4:23:10 AM: Update finished

 

 

In essence, I'm manually solving the order of precedence thing that I need instead of Ketarin.

 

This is no problem to do of course.

 

But I'm wondering if Ketarin could figure out the order of precedence so that I don't have to? That would be very convenient, but it is probably more programming trouble than it's worth... thoughts on that?

[Ketarin 0.9.9.22 beta]

No, that won't work. Ketarin only replaces variables once within a string, not twice.

Thanks Flo, no problem. I just couldn't remember what the real scoop was (we need to get that doc updated so I don't have to!!!!).

 

at System.Net.WebRequest.Create(Uri requestUri, Boolean useUriBase)

 

If that happens, you're hosed. I can't work around that. Seems like a pretty nasty bug in the .NET FW. You could try to get some help on MS forums maybe... (reinstall .NET SP1?)

 

I wondered about a .NET bug... However, the cause of Ketarin's weird loss of window size/position that occurred is still unknown? (vis a vis emil's thread in "Bugs") The above crash only happens when I rename Ketarin's directory back to the name it had when the window size 'disppeared'. .NET throws some other weird exceptions too when Ketarin's directory is back to that original name and I try different things in Ketarin.

 

So. I could agree these exceptions are not Ketarin's fault since they're probably downstream of the real error. Is it possible to find out just *what* is hanging on to that old directory name (or something uniquely associated with that directory name, etc.)? These exceptions are completely repeatable here. Maybe Ketarin can do something about that part, and maybe Ketarin could guard against that ugly window thing in the first place? I'm pretty sure the window thing is what happened to emil (I'm basing that on his/her description...)